anax wrote:machete wrote:synthetic wrote:Ah.. all kinds of flames and weird threads aside.. neither fun nor competition oriented server or forum generally lets all sorts of phantoms or darkos persist. With all sorts of danis that are bit harder to catch, it'll eventually still get resolved. I can post here to urine phantom or darko off, but reality is that all kinds of servers and forums should've banned both of them 3 (darko) to 7 (phantom and co) *years* ago. That is common sense. In DXMP.. there is deficit of that. In DXMP a person can happily cheat in public for 7 years, and nobody will really do anything about it. Thats our DXMP.
Personally, hardcore cheating warrants permanent ban (which is relative and therell always be new servers surfacing), whereas all sorts of darkoist philosophers likely deserve a much shorter test bans and can benefit from occasional banlist wipes. I am saying this while being fully aware that the chances of darko becoming lighto are next to none.. but this is how communities usually deal with it.
Funny you should mention Darko and Phantom in the same rant. Those two recently became unlikely friends. It's only a matter of time before we see Darko playing with a firerate like Phant's.
I'm one of the people who will happily play a round (or several) with Phant and not once complain about his cheap AR kills. The time for trying to clean up our act has long passed. We're too late. There's no point concerning ourselves with cheaters anymore. Knowing that the inevitable is, indeed, inevitable, I'd rather just play as many rounds as possible, even if they're unfair. Just enjoy it for what it is: a rigged game that gives you a great sense of satisfaction when you beat a cheat while playing fairly.
IDK man, I hear what you're saying, it can be fun to let cheaters play and beat them or otherwise let their hacks mess up.
But rules are rules and I'm talking about the generally accepted rules of all FPS games that prohibit cheating on the grounds of unfairly gained advantage over other players. This is one or more levels above unfair advantages gained from something at fault within the game itself such as EMP jumping to a place you're not supposed to reach.
Changing or relaxing the rules just because there are less players is an incredibly bad idea IMO and I actually think this is one of numerous things that gradually chewed away at DXMP's playerbase... It's no secret to anyone who's played for longer than, say, a year and has talked to older players (and has adequate brain capacity...) that tons of bugs and other faults could have been patched up years ago.
The work that Kai has been doing with input from myself and others, (could mention Alex in this as he introduced fps check to scoreboard) has shown that some of the playerbase simply did not care or put effort into improving the game when it still had more than a ballpark max of what? 25 players, give or take 5.
No doubt this is one of the causes of players leaving, I remember seeing a Skype log you showed of you and Dani when he was in cheating mode, you responded with somet like "solution to dx problems: just make it worse than it already is?"
If people work to FIX (what parts CAN be fixed) a clearly broken or otherwise clunky game then we move one step closer to a situation where we can play without worrying who is abusing bugs, who is abusing fps, or who's going to mess metabolic end product up with EditActor /Preferences??
Basically, among other things, we need the developers of ANNA etc. to get moving, to quote Manderly himself.
I say I don't care about it but the irony is that I was the most strongly opposed to ever having Phant in our skype group in the first place because I don't like his cheating and his constant lying about cheating.
I'm just tired, mate. In 2016, DX will be nothing but the occasional pre-arranged match between 4 people (which is basically the stage we're at already). Cheating Phant is the only active 0 augger who offers me enough of a challenge to make games consistently enjoyable. If he goes, I'll end up playing even less. You know me, I'm not really interested in standing around having a chat. We have skype for that.
I'm still completely opposed to cheating in the abstract. On principle, it's unjustifiable to anyone who wants to play a fair game. But I can also see when I'm beaten. The pragmatic side of me that just wants to play some decent games has well and truly taken over.
It's sad that things have reached the point where I'm advocating immunity for cheaters but I don't think there's anything left to save. We passed the point of no return a long, long time ago. It doesn't matter if we have cheaters or not: the new players ain't coming. All we have to consider is the remaining community and maximising our enjoyment of the game in the time we have left. For this reason, I'm happy to let the community decide our collective stance on cheating even though I think we're wasting our time.
On a personal note, when someone who isn't normally as good as me cheats while playing against me, I don't mind much. As you might remember me saying, I was actually okay with the GEP guns that were in FGS 0A for a while. I continued to use rifles and suddenly even total newbies were a major threat. It was just another way of getting a good game. One of the main reasons I hate ATDM is the "winner's advantage" but I don't have as much of a problem when the loser has the advantage. It'd be selfish of me to try to force everyone else to accept cheating just because it makes the game more interesting for me though.
(don't ask me for the kentie's fix, i have lags with it and it doesn't work anyway :P)
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