HERE you go guys, talk it out, or try to.

[anax]

ahhh yeah, i wanted to think of something like that for couldn't get it into my head

Yeah, DXAG is a great gateway to learning augs, and tbh mods are cool, we just need enough players to fit each game type.

[anax]

ahhh yeah, i wanted to say something like that but couldn't get it into my head

Yeah, DXAG is a great gateway to learning augs, and tbh mods are cool, we just need enough players to fit each game type.

[ShadowRunner]

I would like to apologize for recent negativity in all threads. Back in the spirit of what Anax started...

I think what I have been saying is irrelevant. I saw a consistent 12-16 players on 2-3 times over the weekend. Also a lot of what we are saying, did not happen this weekend at all and games seemed relatively smooth and idiot-free.

@Masta - I thought you were an augger? Not to harp on but we have:

ATDM
CTDM/BTDM
inf bio - like Karky
Hejhuka's augs - fun with Arena mod and bowens weps.
DXRV Spell augs - never played it myself.
DXAG - needs more maps and the "forgotten" ones like DXAG_Breakout by Magus.
Cozmo - optional augs
Cagematch - optional augs
Hengsha augs - I should be hosting it I guess... new augs and like DXHR. aug play MP like HR! I just hate Steam but...

Some obviously are better than others for beginners to learn on. The only thing I would do to ATDM is remove 20mm on Silo, finish Smuggler with a car park spawn, and do whatever ppl wanted to A51. I think Ste made a point, that default maps could be evolving, his Cath version is great. A series of polls could determine the exact edits and someone like Chinny or Chees could finish what Ste started.

[[FGS]Chees]

I'm starting to map again and get back into it since I cant physically work or do much else atm so maybe I could do some finishing touches to an unfinished map.

[DaniSaggenza]

Nice to see people playing and mapping again tbh...

[ShadowRunner]

The problem I am having is making an ATDM which is both small, yet covers various features of the engine like elevators, water, cameras, doors etc, but also covers and balances various aug paths such as sniping, tooling, tanking etc. CMD does this, but it is huge.

[synthetic]

I've realized couple times that in theory it is possible to change/improve the game experience drastically by using only existing settings and mapping elements. In practice it'll be tricky to map it out so that players like it.

For small example: we have aug that protects against EMP and poison, so why not add some valuable pickups to a near-death gas or severe EMP zone? Similar deal with aqualung and water zones. And there are other ideas, too.

So basically the maps could be hugely improved by.. just building them to support what we already have.

Entire map will be made or broken by player pathing anyway regardless of whether its iceworld or some very complex map. If one player cant find the other player its done for. Fortunately that could always be re-built as well..

Radar trans is heavily under-used, but I am not too sure that filling the map with million turrets is the ideal solution for players' preference.

@Masta - I thought you were an augger? Not to harp on but we have:

He's 0auger who wasn't afraid of competitive aug match. He played in war vs [T] (as Alpha member I think??) and thats higher profile aug war than what Ive ever had. He played very good, too, considering. Something to rub under Jean's nose, imo

[anax]

DXMP_Factory is gonna be built for ATDM.

I stopped editing it 2 months ago cause i thought DX was about to die fully, but we have a burst of activity this month and older players are coming out of the shadows again, even tonight another American player came back. So now is the time to return to the map.

I'd like to take this opportunity in view of Christmas activity, so i thought, Hey or Sev can host it upon completion for an ATDM test run.

I'll also be making it available for download so people with Augging experience can test it privately, that way i can become a better aug mapper.

[[FGS]Chees]

synthetic I CANT STRESS THIS ENOUGH. Players hate new maps, RPG, 0-Aug, ATDM, 0-Gravity maps anything new they have not played on before they diss, hate and disrepair it was even made for DX. YET iCEWORLD MAP lets battle on it till we are dead...go figure! Even original actors on a MP map's applied to MP maps like I have done baffles certain players when hosting a new map they metabolic end product them self's because it's new and the win/lose score may change in the process while they play and get used to the map. Why cant players remove the STICK OUT THERE STUBBORN ARSE AND BE THANKFUL DX IS STILL ONLINE!

[synthetic]

0augers like iceworld because it quickly gets you enemy to shoot at and team play is covered as well with map being so small that you can easily find teammate. I've sometimes called it the ideal map that isn't a map. Obviously a real map would be a bit better than that.

Augers like default small maps for same reason, while augers and 0augers both are very fond of smuggler. Since augers sometimes tend to prefer even Smuggles over Smuggler, you can also see why when you compare the maps. Smuggles is not a pretty map, but it is more spacious (Speed Enhancement) and provides few more seconds to set up strategy than the smaller Smuggler.

Multiplayer maps for shooters have to be as simple as possible in general *and* provide decent performance, so it is always a battle a mapper has to fight to actually make it interesting and aesthetically pleasing given those limits. In the end, if available routes don't properly lead to conflict hotspots and-or to other team, and performance is horrible, no pretty or complex map is going to win players over.

Then there is the fact that some players are very "conservative" about their maps, as in afraid or uncomfortable with changes. Only solution to that is keep hosting maps as long as the not so conservative players appreciate it. In time the minority will get used to the new maps as if they were old.
If humanity was always that conservative we would still be using stone tools.

Provided there are multitude of servers to choose from, maps that are hosted also shape what kind of players you have in your server. IE if server hosts weird metabolic end product like sniper box then the server will mostly have weird players.*

* being extremely sniper-focused in 0a is actually a phase a new player goes through, and such beginner players also prefer sniper-only maps ie that JCMental's map and sniperbox. Its actually a normal phase but servers that arent beginner focused should avoid hosting one-cube maps, because - well - they aren't maps. Advanced players can enjoy sniper-only gamestyle on any map, including custom ones

[anax]

This is why i made DXMP_KnifeWolrd to be the thinking-man's alternative to IceWorld, simple enough for fast 0-aug sniper battles, additional complexity in moderation and in strategic locations, to stop it from becoming just another SniperBox clone of somekind.

And Sniper, CK and Shuriken are the only weapons, forcing players to adopt a mostly non rifle strategy, in the hope of diversifying the range of weapon skills and styles.

Machete does have it, i've sent it to him, but idk where he's at, guess i'll hand it to Sev too.

[ShadowRunner]

For small example: we have aug that protects against EMP and poison, so why not add some valuable pickups to a near-death gas or severe EMP zone? Similar deal with aqualung and water zones. And there are other ideas, too.

This is easy to visualize as a "scary" challenge in a map, thanks for the info.

Radar trans is heavily under-used, but I am not too sure that filling the map with million turrets is the ideal solution for players' preference.

Poor is creating all kinds of security metabolic end product these days, cameras that can tell if you smoke weed or not. Radar Trans could come in to it's own easily in the future, no need for turrets, there's cameras, alarms, angry security bots and other door security that could be made.

@Masta - I thought you were an augger? Not to harp on but we have:

He's 0auger who wasn't afraid of competitive aug match. He played in war vs [T] (as Alpha member I think??) and thats higher profile aug war than what Ive ever had. He played very good, too, considering. Something to rub under Jean's nose, imo [/quote]

Good to hear other people are mapping.