"Two altfire server" debate

[ShadowRunner]

Since you always get me wrong if I elaborate in long terms I'll try to make it short:


ALTFIRE-SERVER + ALTFIRE-SERVER = BAD

ALTFIRE-SERVER + SG-SERVER = GOOD

So my friend what you are basically saying is that you AGREE with Shadowrunner.

Look at it this way. One altfire server, give the noobs the small maps they want where you can not fly or do metabolic end product and you can shoot/grenade from one spawn into another. Second server is low grav and SG maps and classic sci fi altfire maps.

Problem solved. Or look at it this way... I'm gonna host Orbital, Nexus, Silo when finished, Skyline when finished, Moonbase when finished, Abydos, CMD and all the A51's.... basically every SG map, including anything Kalman makes. Your server got vac, this server got lams. Problem solved again.

Since the maps and the players will be different, I don't see any issue with two servers having low grav and spacey weps. Especially since both host work done by FGS. You say this is "bad", but you have not allowed the experiment, so I wonder where your godlike knowledge comes from

[ShadowRunner]

ok let me put it this way...

Imagine you dedicated months and months and months of your life to making maps specifically for low grav/tnag.

Suddenly someone is telling you that you can not host these maps yourself, that you can only host them on one particular server.

How would you feel and what would you think about those people.

If you think you are doing the right thing with Iceworld and SG on same server, good luck, it's not my business.

But really, is it your business to stop me hosting SG with low grav and tnag? That's what Orbital, Nexus, Moonbase etc were designed for...

[~][FGS][Nobody~]

Problem solved. Or look at it this way... I'm gonna host Orbital, Nexus, Silo when finished, Skyline when finished, Moonbase when finished, Abydos, CMD and all the A51's.... basically every SG map, including anything Kalman makes. Your server got vac, this server got lams. Problem solved again.

Since the maps and the players will be different, I don't see any issue with two servers having low grav and spacey weps. Especially since both host work done by FGS. You say this is "bad", but you have not allowed the experiment, so I wonder where your godlike knowledge comes from

Hosting an SG server with all SG maps and a bit of low gravity (like it was done years ago too) is a great idea.
So yes, I do agree with you to host a second server containing SG maps and spacy weapons (like tactial perhaps?).
....but,I do NOT agree with hosting another server that contains tnag(altfire)

But really, is it your business to stop me hosting SG with low grav and tnag? That's what Orbital, Nexus, Moonbase etc were designed for...

Generally, I cannot dictate what you may or may not do.. if you want you could ignore me completely and host them nevertheless.
However this is not constructive in my eyes...

According to your SG maps... you were designing the SG maps for lowgrav and altfire?
This is a conceptual problem at your end, my friend.
I know.. altfire hosts SG maps but they were never designated to be used for altfire natively.
I just checked your maps and thank god, they are not natively bound to tnag.

Imagine you dedicated months and months and months of your life to making maps specifically for low grav/tnag.
Suddenly someone is telling you that you can not host these maps yourself, that you can only host them on one particular server.

There were never ever hosted two FGS servers with tnag weapons.. and that for a reason.
..and if you recall correctly.. I do not hesitate to host your altfire maps on FGS altfire.

If you think you are doing the right thing with Iceworld and SG on same server, good luck, it's not my business.

Well, the thing with the new maps (including iceworld) actually happened because a German FGS guy (who we both know well ;] ) told me to simply add something new and to await feedback. Obviously your feedback is not that positive lol.
According to SG..
You are right.. the altfire server hosts SG maps.. so why should I host SG maps on altfire, while you're not allowed to host altfire maps on SG.
But I tell you something... if you will REALLY set up an SG server with all SG maps, I will remove all SG maps from altfire, so you will host SG exclusively! DEAL?


But if you host SG server... please do not make the gravity as low as on altfire. SG used to have lower gravity but never as much as on altfire.

[ShadowRunner]

There were never ever hosted two FGS servers with tnag weapons.. and that for a reason.
..and if you recall correctly.. I do not hesitate to host your altfire maps on FGS altfire.

This isn't an answer to the question. So you are forcing me to host my maps alongside iceworld on mapvote on 1 server. You are the boss of DX now it seems. All I want to do is make a server which is sci fi and SG and low grav / tnag. I do not think you have the right to force me to put these newer SG maps on a server with iceworld or non-SG maps. There should be nothing stopping a server which is tnag/low grav and only SG maps. I don't believe it's your decision at all.

And what makes my server a FGS server, you said I wasnt a member lol, so there is nothing to worry, there will not be two FGS servers, by your decisions. I can run a low grav/tnag server with SG maps and it definitely will not be a FGS server if u want.
I'm doing this because players requested it. Some people want iceworld in Altfire, fine, I respect that. Some people want a server with exploration and more SG stuff. I don't think it is right that SG has to share a server with 0-aug maps like iceworld, especially if Altfire hosts mapvote.

[~][FGS][Nobody~]

Show me the phrase of my prior post where I told you to host the SG maps with iceworld??

[ShadowRunner]

You say I can only host them on Altfire server. If you have been absent or joined FGS after these maps started getting hosted and feedback etc, that's not my fault. I've done my best to explain.

Orbital and Nexus just won't work without space weps and low grav. Same for Moonbase and probably others. I just want to make an SG server. Again you can not force me to have players running around with Colt Commando on a space map.

To quote an FGS member, when he was an Alpha member...

Wait-- what? People can't even host what they want anymore?

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 08 12:50 pm

He was defending Alex hosting altfire. I'm not even suggesting that at all. I'm not calling it altfire, I'm not suggesting hosting anyone's map except mine (and yours I assumed but fair enough) and I don't intend to add 8red, iceworld, proteus or anything else then. I simply believe the SG maps, everyone's maps, deserve the right place, and it certainly isn't competing with iceworld lol.
So my server will not really be an altfire server at all, other than it has low grav and tnag weps. Call it SG or whatever.

Again, I don't really see the fuss. This is not like [A] hosting Altfire and calling it altfire. Also I'm not preventing anyone else hosting these maps if they want to. I don't see how I am doing anything wrong.

The only thing that would change my mind is if you were to revert the FGS server to "altfire" maps, then you would have some argument, but otherwise you can not seriously expect me to be happy to host years of work on mapvote with ancient 0-aug maps or even any ordinary non-SG map. I want the server to be SG, and to be spacey. It's what players want, I know. I don't care if it is FGS or not, but I do care when people start saying what weapons I can do on a SG server or not, because that is non-democratic and rules out a whole bunch of players who want it.

[~][FGS][Nobody~]

This

my server will not really be an altfire server at all

and this

other than it has low grav and tnag weps

is contradictory.
Low gravity and tnag is the combination that constitutes FGS altfire. There it is completely irrelevant how you call it.

Since you always disagree with me.. tell me what do YOU think constitutes FGS altfire??

The only thing that would change my mind is if you were to revert the FGS server to "altfire" maps

The majority of maps ARE altfire maps.
If you're referring to the DXMS maps.. I already told what's up with them in my last post.

I don't care if it is FGS or not, but I do care when people start saying what weapons I can do on a SG server or not, because that is non-democratic and rules out a whole bunch of players who want it.

As I also ALREADY said in my last post... now on bigger letters that you actually read it.

Generally, I cannot dictate what you may or may not do.. if you want you could ignore me completely and host them nevertheless.
I just tell you what I THINK is a good idea and what not.
So if you keep refuse to listen to advices and if you want to enforce your will, GO AHEAD, host your "non-altfire" server with tnag and low grav.

'nuff said..

[ShadowRunner]

I could but I'd prefer to firstly respect everyone including makers of SG and Altfire...

It might look selfish or annoying but...

the reality is - sitting on server for sometimes 6 hours, before enough players to be able to vote huge map and lucky with mapvote... i tried few times recently, if less than 10 players it's selfish to mapvote SG, because guaranteed when only 4 players at night etc, they'll prefer smaller maps, there's ,many reasons why i am pushing for an altfire sg server, the world will not end, it will help both servers.
with kalman on board sg mapping too, it inspires me to finish off quick whats lurking on the bench...

the difference also would prolly be inf bio and limited augs as a trial. I notice that Area51_TheDayAfter is often voted on ZXC.

I just think then that it won't cause problems, where someone wants to see SG maps when the server is not massively busy, it actually will retain more players in your altfire server, than make people leave, which is what sometimes happens.

I wish I could classic SG too at same time, but I think others will and also we wait on Cath, Chris's map and DJ weps etc, same me maybe I can host classic and spacey at same time in future.

[ShadowRunner]

Don't get knickers in a twist... if it's THAT holy the gametype then ok I will host Bowens?

It's problem also of removing dependencies in the maps of things like grav-rifle etc.
And some maps aren't finished etc.
Is it possible add vortex grenades to SG maps and have RX lams etc...
Just a big pain in the ...
So many questions and argh.
Would take me 30 mins to host the server I suggest too.
I think Tac also, some people are gonna get annoyed, because I would not put Parker Hale in spawnrooms.

[~][FGS][Nobody~]

Hmm.. fine.. before this debate will never end..

What about you host an altfire SG server only with all SG maps and other spacy stuff, while all SG maps get removed from FGS altfire...
So you got your SG altfire server while it doesn't get too much into conflict with the FGS altfire server.

Mind, since I am NO dictator, this is just an idea, because I could consider to live with that compromise.

However, I cannot enforce such a decision without consulting the other members of FGS since it is not MY server but the server of FGS.


EDIT:
Hmm.. hosting bowen.. well.. it's up to you. However, not even I am prepared to host bowen yet.. not sure if you'll manage it then.
If you tend to decide to host bowen, you should use Bowen4, though.

[ShadowRunner]

umm I think some players will miss some of them...

if you are hosting Bowens that is awesome.

since space maps are not ready really it is not really a problem, for now i can host cmd and a51 type maps etc

[Mastakilla]

+1 for talking!

[bamz0rz]

I would love to see a counterstrike gametype server. I will start working on another mod like that but it will take me a long time because my coding skills are really just borrowing other's codes.

And I agree there is no point in hosting 2 altfires.

I saw shadow hosting a decent counterstrike/realistic server with landernau and clyzms' weapons. But again, we need a gametype that is good. Something with multiple games, like ctf, control territory, or elimination.

[[FGS]Kalman]

Domination sounds good, like in UT99