Altfire February

[ShadowRunner]

A number of people have asked/suggested I make this topic. It's not a complaint, just observations. I know how hard it is.

I think I speak for many, when I say...

1. We're all sick of 8red being voted so much and the general tactics people are using on that map. I think the rest of maplist is half the reason why. Some really unsuitable maps there atm.

2. Some nice maps have been removed and people miss them. Amtrack Warz, Prodigy, Smuggler_tnag and apparently pacman.

3. If I see maps like dxms_confontration being played, I don't even bother joining. It's like 8red, completely unfair. The rifle is not accessible without exposing yourself. Mantra's map is different, there are many features and points of interest, but confrontation is just a basic 0-aug map, yet Mantra's map is removed. Generally my jaw drops in amazement that some altfire maps are removed and replaced with 0-aug normal grav maps which are even older, and it's been this way for quite some time now.

[anihex]

I agree with Shadow in most parts. Only Pacman is a map I don't want to see on AltFire ever again. Regardless how much it's like by the other players. Way to tiny and some weapons are only at a specific spawn. I hate this the most.

I checked the maplist while I checked confrontation. So here's a list of the maps I think should be removed. The other maps I'm unsure or think they're fine.

Unsuited for AltFire
- DXMP_8Red (Annoying, Roof Camper etc.)
- DXMP_FLYTHEPLANES (WAAAY to big for DXMP nowadays)
- DXMP_mau5ville_v2 (Easy "spawnkill" since every spawn can be observed easily and there's no way to avoid that)
- DXMP_Pyramid (I "guess" that's the pyramid, right? A turret at spawn and other stuff ... yeah ...)
- DXMP_Snow_4 (Too small)
- DXMS_Confrontation (Unfair, the Energy is not accessible without exposing yourself)
- DMXS_Magma (Alright, this map HAS to be removed. It's so f*cking unfair and dark ... Even with very high brightness you can't see a sh*t.)
- DXSG_GODZ_A51+Smuggler_V3 (GODZ + Bowen= "shell> format skill:" + "shell> format brain:" )
- DXSG_ORBITAL_TNAG ( See FLYTHEPLANES )

[Majster]

I agree with in some complaints about maps, with some no. In green my opinions.

- DXMP_8Red (Annoying, Roof Camper etc.) I agree. This map often win voting, I hate this.
- DXMP_FLYTHEPLANES (WAAAY to big for DXMP nowadays) This map is cool. There is possible flying by plane.
- DXMP_mau5ville_v2 (Easy "spawnkill" since every spawn can be observed easily and there's no way to avoid that) This map needs fix (spawnkills and some problems with sounds)
- DXMP_Pyramid (I "guess" that's the pyramid, right? A turret at spawn and other stuff ... yeah ...) This map doesn't deserves to be on Atlfrie server...
- DXMP_Snow_4 (Too small) I agree
- DXMS_Confrontation (Unfair, the Energy is not accessible without exposing yourself) I like this map. Energy rifle is difficult to get, but it isn't big problem
- DMXS_Magma (Alright, this map HAS to be removed. It's so f*cking unfair and dark ... Even with very high brightness you can't see a sh*t.) Good map
- DXSG_GODZ_A51+Smuggler_V3 (GODZ + Bowen= "shell> format skill:" + "shell> format brain:" ) Sometimes is good for fun game
- DXSG_ORBITAL_TNAG ( See FLYTHEPLANES )Very good map.

[Mastakilla]

Doesn't seem much wrong with 8red to me

Wins voting for a reason, if the majority really don't like that map, how could that be?

[[FGS]Kalman]

I agree with Shadow in most parts. Only Pacman is a map I don't want to see on AltFire ever again. Regardless how much it's like by the other players. Way to tiny and some weapons are only at a specific spawn. I hate this the most.

I checked the maplist while I checked confrontation. So here's a list of the maps I think should be removed. The other maps I'm unsure or think they're fine.

Unsuited for AltFire
- DXMP_8Red (Annoying, Roof Camper etc.) I like it, maybe needs more lights
- DXMP_FLYTHEPLANES (WAAAY to big for DXMP nowadays) Ye, a bit too big, it took me 5 mins to go to the enemy's spawn
- DXMP_mau5ville_v2 (Easy "spawnkill" since every spawn can be observed easily and there's no way to avoid that) I like it I'll try to fix it
- DXMP_Pyramid (I "guess" that's the pyramid, right? A turret at spawn and other stuff ... yeah ...) It was fun, when Nobody spawned a lot of neutronbombs, superrockets etc.
- DXMP_Snow_4 (Too small) It's good for 0aug
- DXMS_Confrontation (Unfair, the Energy is not accessible without exposing yourself) It needs some editing, but it's impossible now
- DMXS_Magma (Alright, this map HAS to be removed. It's so f*cking unfair and dark ... Even with very high brightness you can't see a sh*t.) I saw this map only once, it looks ok
- DXSG_GODZ_A51+Smuggler_V3 (GODZ + Bowen= "shell> format skill:" + "shell> format brain:" ) I like it, good for some fun with low grav
- DXSG_ORBITAL_TNAG ( See FLYTHEPLANES )It's good too, needs to delete som
e unused parts only

[Majster]

Doesn't seem much wrong with 8red to me

Wins voting for a reason, if the majority really don't like that map, how could that be?

8red wins voting, because people like this map. I can understand why this map is so popular. Playing all time on same maps is boring.

[Alessi]

8red wins voting, because people like this map. I can understand why this map is so popular. Playing all time on same maps is boring.

I think 8red wins because it's first on the voting list so if people don't vote, the next map will, by default, be 8red.

[Mastakilla]

8red wins voting, because people like this map. I can understand why this map is so popular. Playing all time on same maps is boring.

I think 8red wins because it's first on the voting list so if people don't vote, the next map will, by default, be 8red.

That's if no one at all votes, if the majority of the players really care so much, they should put in a vote?

[[FGS]Kalman]

No, the next map will. win on the list eg. if the current map is DXMP_RandomMapA and the next is DXMP_RandomMapB, then RandomMapB won the mapvote

[chin.democ.]

okay these are my thoughts;

- DXMP_8Red (Annoying, Roof Camper etc.)
I'm not a fan of this map simply because of the position of the spawns, if the spawns were inside the buildings it would make for a much better experience imo.

- DXMP_FLYTHEPLANES (WAAAY to big for DXMP nowadays)
It is huge but there's a certain charm to it, you wont get 20 kills or more probably but you'll get a great experience hunting down your enemies.

- DXMP_mau5ville_v2 (Easy "spawnkill" since every spawn can be observed easily and there's no way to avoid that)
Probably too open for Altfire in all honesty.

- DXMP_Pyramid (I "guess" that's the pyramid, right? A turret at spawn and other stuff ... yeah ...)
I think this is the map with one spawn point? Needs to go!

- DXMP_Snow_4 (Too small)
Tested for use with Altfire and it has proven itself to be unsuitable

- DXMS_Confrontation (Unfair, the Energy is not accessible without exposing yourself)
Can't remember this one off hand but DXMS maps were mostly poor to tell the truth.

- DMXS_Magma (Alright, this map HAS to be removed. It's so f*cking unfair and dark ... Even with very high brightness you can't see a sh*t.)
Had a nice idea but poorly executed imo.

- DXSG_GODZ_A51+Smuggler_V3 (GODZ + Bowen= "shell> format skill:" + "shell> format brain:" )
Don't know too much about this map so cannot comment.

- DXSG_ORBITAL_TNAG ( See FLYTHEPLANES )
Another big map but it's cool

The point is everyone has different tastes one man's meat is another man's poison. You can't ever please everyone and so it's a tricky one for sure, I'm not really a fan of mapvote as it leads to boring rotations imo. I must admit though I was a little shocked to see the Altfire maplist dramatically change one day!

[Poor]

I like 8red. Though sometimes punisher will come in and block the spawn room exit.

[anihex]

- DXMP_FLYTHEPLANES (WAAAY to big for DXMP nowadays) This map is cool. There is possible flying by plane.
- DXMS_Confrontation (Unfair, the Energy is not accessible without exposing yourself) I like this map. Energy rifle is difficult to get, but it isn't big problem
- DMXS_Magma (Alright, this map HAS to be removed. It's so f*cking unfair and dark ... Even with very high brightness you can't see a sh*t.) Good map
- DXSG_GODZ_A51+Smuggler_V3 (GODZ + Bowen= "shell> format skill:" + "shell> format brain:" ) Sometimes is good for fun game
- DXSG_ORBITAL_TNAG ( See FLYTHEPLANES )Very good map.

FLY_THE_PLANES: I never said it's not cool. I just say it's way to huge for DXMP. That's quite sad, since it's a FGS Map made by Shadow with a room with the FGS members (at that time).

Confrontation: I guess if two or three enemys camp at the energy you wouldn't be able to get the rifle without a blue beam running through your head ...

Magma: No Energy, as dark as 666's soul, no MedKits, no MediBot, no real weapon, too small, stupid spawns ...

GOD_51+Smuggler_V3: In most cased GODZ itself means nonsense. [GODZ]Bowens weapon mod is their masterpiece of nonsense. But having both is like having sex with a chute (you know ... that thing that's for trash ...

Orbital_TNAG: Honestly. I admire Shadow. Especially for his mapping skills. However, if it's about AltFire I have to judge maps not by who made it, but how does it fit on the server.
And here's the problem: It's like FLY_THE_PLANES. It's a good map. But it's way to huge. Especially for beginners. It's way to confusing and do difficult to get anywhere.

[~][FGS][Nobody~]

ALRIGHT, LET'S SEE..


- DXMP_8Red (Annoying, Roof Camper etc.)
Will be removed for the next 1-2 weeks. Perhaps we can make a quick fix to change the spawns.

- DXMP_FLYTHEPLANES (WAAAY to big for DXMP nowadays)
I personally crash on that map regularly.. but well that's just me. It will remain.

- DXMP_mau5ville_v2 (Easy "spawnkill" since every spawn can be observed easily and there's no way to avoid that)
Will be removed until further notice. I personally like the map.. perhaps some big tubes around the middle could avoid the direct sight?

- DXMP_Pyramid (I "guess" that's the pyramid, right? A turret at spawn and other stuff ... yeah ...)
I like the map for messing around. It will remain but put on the excluded maps list so it cannot be voted.

- DXMP_Snow_4 (Too small)
I agree, it will be removed. It's more suitable for FGS 0aug

- DXMS_Confrontation (Unfair, the Energy is not accessible without exposing yourself)
For the sake of healthiness of Rollo's heart, it will be removed.

- DMXS_Magma (Alright, this map HAS to be removed. It's so f*cking unfair and dark ... Even with very high brightness you can't see a sh*t.)
Hmm a part of that sudden darkness comes from BSP issues.. REMOVAL then.

- DXSG_GODZ_A51+Smuggler_V3 (GODZ + Bowen= "shell> format skill:" + "shell> format brain:" )
This map remains due to ancient awesomeness. It's not voted often anyway, I think

- DXSG_ORBITAL_TNAG ( See FLYTHEPLANES )
Will remain. Rollo made it and he basically knows what's the essence of altfire.

---

Ok now the maps, Rollo mentioned..

- DXMP_Amtrack_Warz
Will be added. I don't remember why it was removed.

- DXMP_Altfire_Prodigy
Will be added. From my estimation this is a good map for close and middle distance battles.

- DXMP_Snuggler_ALTFIREb3 ( guess you mean this one?)
Will be added until further notice. Seems to be ok..

- DXMP_Pacman
Errr. NAY.

---

Mind.. THIS IS NO FINAL DECISION, any further objections are welcome!

[chin.democ.]

If I remember correctly I think I removed Amtrak Warz in anticipation of a newer version with more cover, but I'm not sure if Shadowrunner managed to finish a new version.

[ShadowRunner]

wow and thank you Chinny/Nobody whoever. I think I overstated my point. It's not I want maps removed. I just felt stuff is missing. Also we miss some stuff, not because we removed it, but because we are unable to find or host those maps. Amtrack can be annoying, just like 8 red, could be improved.

- DXMP_FLYTHEPLANES
I would remove this from altfire. It's not too big for vehicles and parachutes though. So if a later version appears, I'll give.

- DXMP_mau5ville_v2
I personally don't see anything wrong with altfighter or this map, except some small edits here and there, I'd put the grenades in altfighter outside and high up, making it harder to get them into the corridors for noobery. Same with mau5ville, it was a learning process, unfinished, fix the spawns/complaints and it could be very altfire.

- DXMP_Snow_4
I think it's ok on altfire, just not my personal choice for altfire due to spawn arrangement and openness in altfire, it's one of my faves on 0-aug server though. It's better than abandoned or pacman imo for altfire, perhaps just needs spawn edits for altfire.

- DXMS_Confrontation
It's up to you guys, it's your server. As I said, it's not I want to see stuff removed, just I felt stuff is missing.

- DMXS_Magma
Since you have Scoutz and could add Spirit, removal doesn't offend me.

- DXSG_GODZ_A51+Smuggler_V3
I don't have a problem. It's up to FGS and experienced players to use the secret door responsibly if beginners are around etc.

DXSG_ORBITAL_TNAG
This is exceptional in free-roaming 4 maps on one server. Other exceptional maps could be on altfire. DXPZ_Cybris etc.

The point about Amtrack, Prodigy and Twinz. They aren't necessarily good altfire maps, but they have interesting extra weps. This is probably why some people miss them. About Amtrack and in fact all my maps hosted. Since you still use them, I will do what I can to update them all very quickly with fixes etc. Probably spawns could be better on Amtrack. So yep, I might need prodding, but should be able to deliver 2012 versions of anything on altfire soon.

I have no problem with pacman either. It's like I said, It's not I want stuff removed, just I see some stuff could be added.
I think also Chinny's maps are missing. Desert Strike, Infiltration even, Encounter, other stuff... all good for altfire. Especially if some extra tnag weps were added.

Generally I think we don't have enough dark, moody, well spawned, spacious cyber-urban maps.