add some rules + general 1 dimensionality

[Mastakilla]

you guys are very amusing

There's no way you're 21. Unless you've got some sort of mental handicap.

[anax]

you can't be older than 15 if that's how readily you react in a negative manner. I was actually genuinely amused keep on sui gepping - I can't stop you from being retarded.

[~][FGS][Nobody~]

I'd appreciate it, if we stayed on topic without personal insults.
And anax.. playing the mature guy that stays above all things is actually just a cheap way to escape a debate when running out of arguments.

[anax]

well there's nothing more to say. if i went off topic it's because i was responding to masta and others.

The thread was meant to be a civilized discussion about over-use of rifles and the lack of good sportsmanship/gameplay in sui gepping, but like every other thread in this community it turned to flaming. And whining about how suiciding is so awesome.

[Psycho]

well there's nothing more to say. if i went off topic it's because i was responding to masta and others.

The thread was meant to be a civilized discussion about over-use of rifles and the lack of good sportsmanship/gameplay in sui gepping, but like every other thread in this community it turned to flaming. And whining about how suiciding is so awesome.

Yeh but that's just them giving their opinion?

[Mastakilla]

Actually I'm just going to drop out of this since nothing good will come of it.

[~][FGS][Nobody~]

And whining about how suiciding is so awesome.

That's one of the problems, which turned this thread into what it is.
You declare some users' opinions about the advantages and reasons for sui gepping as whining, while they were having reasonable arguments.

What puts you in the position to declare that sui gepping is no proper use of the weapon, just because you've learned the common ways.
I agree, excessive sui gepping is not the goal since the primary goal is to get a decent score.
However, if you take one for the team in order to terminate an augged and skilled up player, then it IS definitely a proper strategy.
You auggers claim that augs is so much more varying and requires more strategy than other gametypes.
Therefore I'm actually surprised that you of all don't see the point in a specific suicide gep kill.

[anax]

i wasn't attempting to escape argument because you were repeating the same reason over and over for why suiciding is good, so i had nothing interesting coming my way to respond to.

yes it's an opinion psy, but it's an opinion which supports a "tactic" that contradicts the whole idea of skilled, logical and/or tactical DXMP gameplay.


ok I'll spell it out for both of you.

suicide gepping is weak because:

1 - you kill yourself.
2 - there's no thought or complex skill involved in just running into a guy and firing a rocket.
3 - there are plenty of other ways to take down a streaked augger,
3a - gaining a streak yourself to grab better augs etc.
3b - learning how he plays and setting up your own augs and weapons to counter his style.
3c - using the surroundings to evade him and wait until he is vulnerable
3d - when he's unaware of you > LAMs, EMPs, LAWs, GEPs - fack it, any weapon - his augs could all be turned off.

in the interest of a good debate please tell me more than 3 reasons (which don't all start with "because i ended his streak") why suiciding is great.

[Mastakilla]

i wasn't attempting to escape argument because you were repeating the same reason over and over for why suiciding is good, so i had nothing interesting coming my way to respond to.

yes it's an opinion psy, but it's an opinion which supports a "tactic" that contradicts the whole idea of skilled, logical and/or tactical DXMP gameplay.


ok I'll spell it out for both of you.

suicide gepping is weak because:

1 - you kill yourself.
2 - there's no thought or complex skill involved in just running into a guy and firing a rocket.
3 - there are plenty of other ways to take down a streaked augger,
a - gaining a streak yourself to grab better augs etc.
b - learning how he plays and setting up your own augs and weapons to counter his style.
c - using the surroundings to evade him and wait until he is vulnerable
d - when he's unaware of you > LAMs, EMPs, LAWs, GEPs - fack it, any weapon - his augs could all be turned off.

in the interest of a good debate please tell me more than 3 reasons (which don't all start with "because i ended his streak") why suiciding is great.

Can I instead argue this part:

but it's an opinion which supports a "tactic" that contradicts the whole idea of skilled, logical and/or tactical DXMP gameplay.

?

Because though you said I repeat it too much, I already explained the logical and tactical side of it. I also explained the skilled side of it arguing that against a streaked player, who probably also knows his stuff as in ADS + Energy shield making gep rockets highly ineffecient, it's next to impossible to suicide gep that person. So it takes some skill to pull that one off succesfully, can't you understand that?

1. You kill yourself, but the goal is to take the other guy with you, so you kill yourself AND him.
2. There's in fact thought and skill involved because in an augged gametype, other skilled players know that ADS + Energy Shield will cancel it out. You can come as close as you want but you wont be able to take the person out. Maybe if you're standing point blank you might get lucky. The other person would take you out before you can get that close though. So if you just run into a person and fire a rocket you would indeed just kill yourself. If you meant by suicide gepping "people using gep guns over and over even though everyone is using ADS and they're only getting themselfs killed" then yes suicide gepping is dumb. If you actually manage to take someone out with it though, it's a good thing. As long as it's not excessively done.
3. Ofcourse there are plenty of ways to play, but who the f are you to dictate how anyone plays? People should play how THEY want, as long as it follows the rules of the server. Servers have rules on EXCESSIVE suicide gepping but you are actually complaining about SUCCESFUL suicide gepping.

I don't do any suicide gepping, mostly because I hardly even play DX and when I do I avoid ATDM at all cost. I've played ATDM alot though and I was in [T] at the time Raidèn was along with SilentScope and them, played a clanwar against [A] and won, had a good time. I never did any suicide gepping when playing seriously if I remember correctly, however when just messing about I have done it, and it was entertaining and didn't break any server rules. I'm just defending the idea of it because you're being a bit of a male sex organ. Why? Because you're trying to dictate how people play. Not even recommending doing otherwise, just plain out saying it's retarded. And that's disrespectful.

[Psycho]

Well the reason is to End a Streak though. That's a super good reason

2 - there's no thought or complex skill involved in just running into a guy and firing a rocket.

3d - when he's unaware of you > LAMs, EMPs, LAWs, GEPs - fack it, any weapon - his augs could all be turned off.

Aint those both the same?

3a - gaining a streak yourself to grab better augs etc.
3b - learning how he plays and setting up your own augs and weapons to counter his style.
3c - using the surroundings to evade him and wait until he is vulnerable
3d - when he's unaware of you > LAMs, EMPs, LAWs, GEPs - fack it, any weapon - his augs could all be turned off.

3a - What if all the members of the other team are streaked, or are good players like Monkee/Ricci/Scar/Blade etc? Super hard to kill them when streaked

3c - Ye but using the surrounding and getting there is going to make you consume bio, while he may have 5 biocells and biobot skills.

I do think sui gepping is justified, cos f9 and f3 should defend against it. Although excessive is homosexual.

[~][FGS][Nobody~]

I can say it quite unemotional. I do not see another reason to suicide gep.
That's why I can just give my feedback to your paragraphs.

1 - you kill yourself.

Yes, but in that case it's a well considered sacrifice.

2 - there's no thought or complex skill involved in just running into a guy and firing a rocket.

It doesn't require complex skill but there's a thought, as I explained in my prior post.

3 - there are plenty of other ways to take down a streaked augger,
3a - gaining a streak yourself to grab better augs etc.

In theory yes, but unlikely if you keep getting overwhelmed by that player.

3b - learning how he plays and setting up your own augs and weapons to counter his style.

In theory yes, and on the long sight yeah, but on the concrete situation, nope. A game usualy doesn't last two hours.

3c - using the surroundings to evade him and wait until he is vulnerable
3d - when he's unaware of you > LAMs, EMPs, LAWs, GEPs - fack it, any weapon - his augs could all be turned off.

I agree, that would be an adequate way but it could take a while too since those players usually have a 6th sense for hiding enemies, from what I experienced.

why suiciding is great.

Also I want to make clear, that I never used the word 'great' or a synonym. I just estimated it as proper strategy. Let's say it's the way 3e, if 3a to 3d fail.


EDIT: ok a million posts have been done while I was writing, but I'll post mine nevertheless.

[anax]

where did i say "you MUST or you SHOULD play dx without suicide gepping" ?

i don't want to dictate how others play, my argument is more to do with speaking up for myself and letting my dislike of suiciding be known.

all your pro-sui gep reasons i can indeed understand, it's entirely fine if you want to play that way or not.

As you say yourself suicide gepping vs a streaked augger will be insanely difficult - so why suicide on them if it's so hard?

This is why i support using other methods of unstreaking.


edit:

well yea lol, games don't last that long, i meant it as in: watch how they play over several maps every time you come across them in a server.
- and learn from it so you can discover how to unstreak them, (if you wanna suicide 'em that's fine on your terms I'll use my own methods.)

heh yea that's true, it's cause they probably know where cloaked dudes will be hiding, so the solution is easy - watch them and hide in a totally different part of the room from where most others will usually hide.

[Mastakilla]

where did i say "you MUST or you SHOULD play dx without suicide gepping" ?

From first post:

this guy should be advbanned by now, you know who I mean - the 140 ping guy who trolls and persistently fails spectacularly at trying to imitate me.
He spectates before he dies, this should really be a top rule at the same level as suicide gepping in augs - I urge you to please have a serious discussion that hopefully ends with this rule being implemented.

Although to me it's vague who the hell you're talking about there, although it may not even be a specific person. But you're saying they should be advbanned, same as suicide gepping.

I'm glad you agree with me saying it's insanely difficult, it's not the best thing to do but I don't see how something is cheap, like you've been saying this whole time when it's hard to pull off.

If it's not what you meant though, you can be annoyed at people's play style all you want. And you're entitled to your opinion, so whatever, I shouldn't have taken this discussion so far as it's not worth it. Opinions vs opinions blahblahblah it doesn't matter in the end, let's just agree to disagree

Sorry for the insults.

[anax]

it's fine man all banter and shiz, i was the first to use the word retarded so should of been the first to back away and rethink.
But anyway, i meant that specific guy should be banned - for spectating before dying.
Thanks to yourself and Nobody i've run out of steam trying to convince you that suiciding is gheighy. if your victim dies and loses his streak then feck it, who am i to say it didn't change the tide of the game?

[Mastakilla]

it's fine man all banter and shiz, i was the first to use the word retarded so should of been the first to back away and rethink.
But anyway, i meant that specific guy should be banned - for spectating before dying.
Thanks to yourself and Nobody i've run out of steam trying to convince you that suiciding is gheighy. if your victim dies and loses his streak then feck it, who am i to say it didn't change the tide of the game?

So to get back to the original topic I suppose, who is this guy? He's not been named?